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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4247 Posts
My Collection
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 Posted - Jun 30 2013 : 10:34:40 AM
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| amazing to see this! |
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Jun 30 2013 : 6:22:27 PM
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Wow, very nice!
Too bad the lens is missing.
Let's see if/how fast it is sold for this price.
Regards,
Christian |
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Jul 01 2013 : 2:29:53 PM
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Yes, the lens is missing.
Probably, in these very early numbers, it had the same s/n as the body...
Jacques.
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Jul 13 2013 : 05:35:31 AM
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An interesting detail for this camera, I think.
The catch of the lock is screwed on the shutter box, like on all the Leicas. On Feds, I had only seen riveted ones till now.
An evolution or a repair with Leica parts?
To compare, I have the 1a s/n 5330 with rivets, and the 4642 with screws. But I think the last one was repaired with Leica parts.
If you have early 1a-s, it would be interesting to know...
Amitiés. Jacques. |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Jul 24 2013 : 6:22:09 PM
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I'm always fascinated by the details you notice, Jacques.
Interestingly, my 'new' FED1a No#1233 has those screws as well:
All my other FED1c-e including the FED-S have rivets.
So either both of those early cameras have been repaired with Leica parts - which seems very unlikely, or - there was a transition from a Leica-like design with screws to rivets somewhere between serial #4642 and #5330.
Regards,
Christian |
Edited by - Niko80 on Jul 24 2013 6:34:02 PM |
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 09:18:49 AM
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I had forgotten my 1a s/n 5431, always with rivets.
About my s/n 4642, it really has Leica parts: plate of the lens (in fact, the two ones: the body one with a "0" and the lens one with Leitz engravings), the sensor of the rangefinder which is Leica shaped, even the shape of the catch of the lock, wider than on Feds, etc.
In fact, certainly the shutter box was replaced by a Leica's (A, C or D before 1933).
So the limit is before that number.
Jacques. |
Edited by - Jacques M. on Jul 26 2013 09:35:27 AM |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 4:04:46 PM
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A strange mixture indeed.
Do you think the lens is original? It has a pretty high serial.
But I guess we can now say that early FED cameras really had screws and those are original.
By the way - would you add your FED1a SN and lens SN to the wiki? Might be interesting to see what early camera-lens combinations looked like.
Regards,
Christian
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 09:34:16 AM
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For sure, the lens (of the 1a on eBay) is not original: it's not a "one turn". It would rather be a 1d's, by the serial number (c. s/n 150000 for the body?)
OK to put my 1a-s on the wiki, of course!.
Jacques. |
Edited by - Jacques M. on Jul 27 2013 09:35:42 AM |
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2013 : 6:47:48 PM
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Thank you for sharing this, Bill!
Surely a beautiful camera, I see it also has screws instead of rivets at the base plate.
Could you post a picture of the lens mount with the lens unscrewed?
My camera has a broad rangefinder sensor.
Regards,
Christian |
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Aug 01 2013 : 08:36:58 AM
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Beautiful and rare!
I am puzzled by the big screw on the shutter box, not far from the bottom screw (which ties the shutter box to the body).
This screw hides a big hole on Christian's camera. This hole is more little on the 5xxx series. It always exists on my 1b s/n 7122, but has disappeared on my 7373. Nothing after.
Has anybody an idea? What is this hole for?
Jacques.
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Aug 04 2013 : 5:28:05 PM
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Excellent photos, Bill!
Some more from my camera:
The broad rangefinder sensor
The hole in the bottom of the shutter box Jacques mentioned doesn't lead anywhere, there's nothing behind - it's really just a hole. I have no idea what it is for.
Regards, Christian |
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Aug 04 2013 : 11:52:31 PM
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Christian,
The rangefinder sensor on my No. 1227 is a more rectangular shape. Not so broad on the end that contacts the lens. Basically rectangular with a rounded back and no threaded hole like yours has. It just looks flat with no hole or anything. I also have two other early FEDs, No.2313 and No.5585, both with burnished finish and they also have a rectangular rangefinder sensor. And rectangular seems to be what I have seen on all of the early FEDs so far, except yours. I have a feeling that yours may have a replaced rangefinder sensor. Maybe Jacques can look at any he has and see what they look like. Here is a photo of what all three of mine look like (this is a photo of No. 1227)
http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/482013_sensor1.jpg
Regards, Bill
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2013 : 03:27:38 AM
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So, the hole is nothing but a hole! Perfect!
I have never seen a sensor like yours, Christian, on any of my Fed 1... In fact, it could look like a Fed 2's or a Zorki's.
My 1a have sensors like Bill's, except the chromed s/n 4642 which has a Leica's. Logical: the external barrel of the lens comes from a Leica too!
Jacques. |
Edited by - Jacques M. on Aug 05 2013 03:45:36 AM |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2013 : 6:23:58 PM
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Very strange...
Indeed it's a Zorki or later FED sensor.
http://www.jay.fedka.com/index_files/Page391.htm
However, the rangefinder seems to be well calibrated for the full turn lens - the double images overlap correctly at 1m and infinity.
Should I waste a roll of film to test it? |
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Aug 06 2013 : 11:04:04 AM
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Probably just a replacement by a repairman when the old one broke off, or possibly became worn down too much. The shape should not matter too much and I believe the difference between the rangefinder function for a full-turn lens and a half-turn lens would be in the rangefinder mechanism, not the shape of the sensor. No doubt the rangefinder is accurate if the images line up correctly and match the lens scale. Probably it is more accurate than most early FEDs for having been worked on.
Regards, Bill
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2013 : 3:16:33 PM
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I agree with Bill: you should not have problems if the repairman has done his job correctly.
As for the difference between a one turn and a half turn lens, I think there is none for the rangefinder. It seems that the thread of the distance ring is different.
I regularly use two of my pre war Fed S. And I have just tried my 1928 Leica I (A). Interesting and not so odd. You should try, Christian...
Amitiés. Jacques. |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2013 : 5:42:41 PM
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My FED-S I use for photography also works great with all the lenses. I've shot about 10 rolls of film so far, once you get used to the camera it's quite easy and fun to operate.
The lens of the FED1a #1233 is a bit hazy so no spectacular images are to be expected...
I've been thinking about having it cleaned by the Vienna Leicashop
but I somehow worry to mess up the original state of the camera...
What's your opinion on having collectible cameras serviced ?
Regards,
Christian |
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4247 Posts
My Collection
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Aug 07 2013 : 01:28:40 AM
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Hi Vlad!
Looks like a FED-1a but with a newer, re-engraved and newly burnished rangefinder housing. It should have a notched front rangefinder window for that serial number. So probably the flash shoe was removed, the holes filled, the top of the rangefinder housing ground down (you can see evidence of this on the front edge of the rangefinder housing near the rewind knob) then some change in the serial number (maybe a number ground off at the end), then burnished to match the rest of the body and top and bottom plates, then a new shutter speed arrow engraved. Finally the rangefinder housing is put in place.
So you end up with a later version of the logo engraving and a later version of the rangefinder front window, but with an early serial number and burnished finish.
This is just a guess! The lens is a later lens too I think, but that is common on the early cameras that are found today.
Regards, Bill
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2013 : 03:35:18 AM
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Christian,
I never had a collectible camera repaired or regulated. I prefer keeping them in the original condition. At least the condition where I received them... It's only my opinion, but it's an important matter, I think.
Vlad,
I agree with Bill.
You have a strange camera, indeed. As if the 1a was first repaired with parts of 9000/11000 1b (the viewfinder with recess), then worked again (burnishing, removing the rangefinder clip...) to give it again its former appearance...
Anyway, it was originally an early Fed 1a, no doubt (screwed catch of the lock).
Amitiés. Jacques. |
Edited by - Jacques M. on Aug 07 2013 03:36:53 AM |
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4247 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Aug 07 2013 : 10:04:24 AM
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Bill, Jacques, thank you for the analysis, I probably would incline to agree with you as well, only it seems like that burnishing was done before the engraving as there are no damage to the engraving.. really odd..
Vlad |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2013 : 9:56:05 PM
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Jacques, I think you are right.
I'll leave the camera as it is.
By the way, what happened to #155?
Was it sold or did the auction end without a bid? |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
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levonsa
levonsa
Russia
248 Posts |
Posted - Oct 01 2013 : 3:02:04 PM
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Hello! Your help is needed to find the truth :)
You can see two screws on the picture. These screws have disappeared in cameras with s/n 5xxx and were replaced with 2 rivets. Could you check your cameras with s/n 5xxx to say me which version with screws/rivets you possess, please? Thanks in advance! Alexey
http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/1102013__MG_0107.JPG
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Edited by - levonsa on Oct 01 2013 3:32:24 PM |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
Posted - Oct 01 2013 : 5:35:20 PM
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Hello Alexey!
What's the s/n of your camera?
So far in this thread we have the following cameras with screws:
# 155
#1233
#1227
#2969
#4642
With rivets:
#5330
Regards,
Christian |
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Jacques M.
France
2575 Posts |
Posted - Oct 02 2013 : 07:51:15 AM
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Hi Alexey!
Good question!
I had not seen these two other inside screws (those pointed by your red line).
All the Leicas I own before the IIIc have these two screws more. So, the models A to G (all the prewar models, in fact).
Concerning the Fed 1a, my # 4642 a screwed lock and these two screws more.
My # 5330 has a riveted lock. And the two inside screws are always there. But their heads are filed, as if they were not useful.
On my # 5431: riveted lock and nothing inside.
So, it seems that the two inside screws disappear somewhere between 5330 and 5431... And that they are in relation with the screwed lock.
Amitiés. Jacques.
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levonsa
levonsa
Russia
248 Posts |
Posted - Oct 02 2013 : 1:02:27 PM
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Jacques and Christian greetings!
I have the camera:
#911-screws
#927-screws
#2969-screws
#5440-rivets.
Besides known camera: / not mine /
#3219-screws
#4545-screws
#4857-screws
#5340 - Bill Parkinson-??
Thank you very much! |
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levonsa
levonsa
Russia
248 Posts |
Posted - Oct 08 2013 : 4:14:51 PM
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| FED #5340 -rivets. |
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David Tomlinson
RCCCUK
United Kingdom
208 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2013 : 02:57:39 AM
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Hi Alexey
My FED 1a #3227 has screws.
David. |
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levonsa
levonsa
Russia
248 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 12:18:28 PM
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| Thank you David! I am very interested in information FED-1 ¹ ¹ 5000-5300. This is a transient cycle. I think this is interesting all the time ..... |
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Niko80
Austria
174 Posts |
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Topic |
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Early Fed 1a
