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 About an Industar 22, a Zorki 3M and a FED2
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 03 2019 :  04:17:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi there

I recently bought (still waiting to receive ... arghh) a Zorki 3M with a jupiter 8, wrongly advertised as a Zorki3, for what i think is a good price (32£ shipped), it includes also the case. from the seller pictures is not in Mint shape but not so bad as well, also he says it is fully working ....





this will be my first leica mount camera, but not the first FSU one, since i have few (i know is really difficult to stop buying these things) Kiev/Contax (KievIII, KievIIa, Contax III). I really liked the line of the Zorki 3M and from some researches on line (after the purchase) i found it is pretty rare (ok, rare is a big word but form the FSU camera it is i think quite difficult to find or at least for a bargain price).

Still waiting the camera to judge the condition myself and test it with film I started to look for a collapsible lens to use with it. My understanding is that the Jupiter should be better than any Industar (10, 22 or 50) but i still like the idea of a compact package to bring with me strolling around, and from this point f view the Industar(s) wins hands down against the Jup.

i found this auction of a FED 2 with I-22 and i received an offer from the owner for 22£ shipped, see picture.


[


the FED looks in quite poor condition (look at the self timer lever ...sob) and also the lens does not looks really in a good shape. But looking for a collapsible lens i can only find sellers from Russia or nearby countries and much higher costs (plus shipment).

One of my doubt is related to the pin (at 1 p.m on the pictures) on the lens, looking for web pictures of the same lens it should be silver coloured not bronze/gold, correct? it means the lens has been mangled by someone? Also i am not an expert in any way, but is the lens from this FED going to work with the Zorki? (i presume so, but i am not sure)

it is just me or i cannot find any collapsible Industars with a reasonable (20£) cost? i always read around that they produced those lenses in milions .... are they running out?

looking for some experts

KR

Marco

Edited by - marcolin on Oct 03 2019 12:37:31 PM
SteveA
United Kingdom
100 Posts
Posted - Oct 03 2019 :  05:23:02 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi it looks like the orginal stop on the I-22 has been snapped off and someone has fitted a replacement. To be honest, quality of the I-22 was patchy to say the least, you would really be better off using the Jupiter 8 in my experience. I tried a I-22 collapsible on my Zorki 3 and it was nothing like as good as the Jupiter, though it did look cool :)

Cheers,

Steve
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 03 2019 :  05:48:28 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SteveA

Hi it looks like the orginal stop on the I-22 has been snapped off and someone has fitted a replacement. To be honest, quality of the I-22 was patchy to say the least, you would really be better off using the Jupiter 8 in my experience. I tried a I-22 collapsible on my Zorki 3 and it was nothing like as good as the Jupiter, though it did look cool :)

Cheers,

Steve



Hi Steve

thanks for the reply, i guess you are right, the I-22 is not in a great shape and i am sure as well it will not be good as the Jup8 (i know the lens in Kiev mount and i use some of them on my Kiev/Contax and i know what is capable of).

but on the other end you are also right about how cool it is and i can't help myself and refrain to buy one and mount on the 3M.

I cannot wait to have the 3M and at the same time i would like to buy the FED2 to play with it as well ... Please tell me that it is not worth to buy it... please.

I am by any extent a collector, but i really like to use/handle/own those cameras ... ok any kind of cameras, but at least RSU are quite gentle on my pocket LOL.

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Jacques M.
France
2272 Posts
Posted - Oct 03 2019 :  08:09:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

The Zorki 3M is one of the most interesting cameras of the fifties. But it was made with the Jup 8 as a normal lens, and the couple is fantastic.
If I were you, and as a collector, I would buy a correct Zorki 1 with a good I22 to put on the Zorki 3M from time to time. But not that poor Fed 2, please...

Amitiés. Jacques.
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 03 2019 :  12:45:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jacques M.


The Zorki 3M is one of the most interesting cameras of the fifties. But it was made with the Jup 8 as a normal lens, and the couple is fantastic.
If I were you, and as a collector, I would buy a correct Zorki 1 with a good I22 to put on the Zorki 3M from time to time. But not that poor Fed 2, please...

Amitiés. Jacques.



Hi Jacques

Thanks for your suggestion.

I am not much in the collecting thing but i think i should wait and start to enjoy the zorki. I think you are right that FED and lens is not what i should buy. I will keep looking for a decent collapsible lens.

But your message is making me thinking about the usage of different lenses from the one who was sold with. I think those are cameras made/designed to use multiple lenses also from different manifacturer or even different eras (older or newer).
Is that something that from a collector point od view is completely wrong?
Just asking

Marco
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zcetrt
45 Posts
Posted - Oct 04 2019 :  06:37:32 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I suggest you first confirm your Zorki 3M works prior buying additional equipment for it. We shouldn't forget the camera is 64 years old and probably not serviced recently.

The FED-2s came with FED lenses. The one in the add thus doesn't have original lens, and as you already noticed, doesn't have original parts.
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 04 2019 :  08:17:20 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by zcetrt

I suggest you first confirm your Zorki 3M works prior buying additional equipment for it. We shouldn't forget the camera is 64 years old and probably not serviced recently.

The FED-2s came with FED lenses. The one in the add thus doesn't have original lens, and as you already noticed, doesn't have original parts.



Hi zcetrt,

very wise suggestion, in fact i already let the FED go, nevermind i have a new toy anyway.

The Z3M is arrived this morning, i already checked and al seems to work, more or less.

time for fast shutters are quite OK (at least just listening, they sound quite right to me) slower one meh, it is mixed bag, 1/2 sec and 1 sec are not working very well the curtain is veryyy slow and sometime hang in partially open position. Of course i do need to run some film to see if it is light tight and see the exposures.
the camera needs a very good clean, it is quite sticky (i think they applied some shoe polish ) but overall is fantastic.

the lens has a very clean glass, smooth apertures and a very tight focus, probably in need of a good clean and lubrication.

will update after the cleaning.

Marco

Edited by - marcolin on Oct 04 2019 09:05:48 AM
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 05 2019 :  2:47:03 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
After the cleaning the Z3M it is quite shiny, a truly wonderful camera, a pleasure to handle and to operate. I shot a test roll this afternoon and if i have time i will try to develop this night or tomorrow.



I have some considerations (personal) and questions, maybe some of them quite stupid but i will be really happy if some owner of the camera can reply:
considerations:

a) the camera is really nice, i like it more than the Kiev II, not sure why, is just a matter of the roundness of the body. Before this zorki i loved the Kiev/Contax shape, but now i think is the other way around.
b) also mechanically i have a better feeling, both my Kiev has been looked after and some sort of CLA has been done (or at least so i have been told) but the Zorki is a bit more enjoyable to use, which is quite an amazing thing considered that this one is just landed on my door step from ebay without ask nothing to the seller (for 30 £ better not ask, it was just an experiment)
c) not sure what they did to the poor camera, it is very sticky, and even after clean with tons of baby wipes, toothbrush and soap (no perfumes) and tens of QTips, the leatherette (or vulcanite) is still smelly and stains my fingers (with the heat of my hands)
Any suggestion to clean it better?
d) cosmetically is ok, 99% of the chrome is still shiny and clean, no scratches, but few little spots the chrome is corroded or gone, but i suppose there is nothing to do. vulcanite is ok, no missing parts, very firm, of course in some areas is a bit worn but is normal for a camera this age.

questions:

1) the dioptric correction adjustment lever is quite stiff, and not sure if it is normal has a quite short run. Not a problem since i must turn it at minimum (no glasses ... yet), how long is the run of the lever in your camera?
2) the lens is in need of a clean inside from probably old grease, any suggestion on the DIY? i never did any surgery on lenses before.
3) During the cleaning of the camera (in particular the release button) the shutter button did not responded any more, the cocking knob was turning without charging the gears, i was panicking a bit, but then i noted the small dot on the release button was not aligned to the red dot on the collar of the button itself, and i realized this has to be a sort of lock of the shutter button. is that something un-documented in the manual? is intended to work this way? I tried to set the camera on B and click the shutter release button turning it gently clockwise ... and it worked on B (shutter ope) till i gently touched (and turning counterclockwise) the button again. I cannot find anything like that on the web, only some reference on the similar behavior of the Zorki3 but maneuvering the slow times knob.



Overall i am impressed by the camera at the point i want to twaek it a bit:

_ buy a soft shutter release (possibly silver maybe red)
_ buy a Camera Thumb Grip/Thumb Support/Thumb Rest to fit on the cold shoe, but not sure if it will be good on the Z3M (since the top is not straight and the grip will not stay flush) any idea?
_ I do want a nice half case, and at the same time i do not want to cut/ruin the original case which came with the camera, so i am thinking to buy a case on ebay for few quids and adapt it, thinking of FED4 (1£ +2 shipment on ebay). not sure what is possible to find which will fit directly on the camera, maybe someone of you already has a solution.

thanks

Marco


Edited by - marcolin on Oct 05 2019 3:02:38 PM
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SteveA
United Kingdom
100 Posts
Posted - Oct 06 2019 :  03:04:36 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi, the vulcanite get get sticky with age, not sure what the solution to that is. The diopter adjuster only moves about 30 degrees. Regarding the lens, unless the elements are greasy I would leave well alone - its so easy to get the grease onto the aperture blades etc., and make the situation worse. If it takes clear photos and is relatively easy to focus/change aperture then thats fine. The shutter button is designed to lock down so that the shutter can be held open on the 'B' setting - I never used this function, just make sure the two red dots are kept lined up and you won't have a repeat of that issue!
You shouldn't really need a soft release as the shutter release on these cameras is already really nice - best to leave the camera as it is as otherwise it spoils the lines of it.
Re. leather cases, there seem to be plenty on Ebay at the moment, for example https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fitted-Camera-CASE-for-ZORKI-3-3M-3C-camera-only-8542/372434640086?hash=item56b6d59cd6:g:ugIAAOSwW4ZbmVkU
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SteveA
United Kingdom
100 Posts
Posted - Oct 06 2019 :  05:55:50 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
...I just looked back at some black/white images I took with my Zorki 3M with the Jupiter 8 and Jupiter 12, they are very good quality. I get the odd internal reflection sometimes (think it may be the silver metallic rangefinder arm, must flat black that...) and I have a slight shutter fade at 1/500 and 1/1000 but we are talking a 65 year old camera here! The Viewfinder is a revelation compared to the Contax III I generally use. Cheers, Steve
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marcolin
25 Posts
Posted - Oct 07 2019 :  11:27:05 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SteveA

...I just looked back at some black/white images I took with my Zorki 3M with the Jupiter 8 and Jupiter 12, they are very good quality. I get the odd internal reflection sometimes (think it may be the silver metallic rangefinder arm, must flat black that...) and I have a slight shutter fade at 1/500 and 1/1000 but we are talking a 65 year old camera here! The Viewfinder is a revelation compared to the Contax III I generally use. Cheers, Steve



Hi Steve

thanks for your reply.

regarding the "restoration" of the camera, the vulcanite is slightly sticky now, but much less, my idea is ti apply a bit of bee wax, clean and let dry for few days.

regarding the lens i would like to use a product like this at east on the outsidehttps://www.amazon.co.uk/Silvo-Tarnish-Guard-Liquid-175Ml/dp/B00IUNAR16/ref=pd_sbs_201_img_1/257-9189079-1110728, anyone some experience with some products?

for the inside i think i will keep as it is. One more doubt about the J8, in this copy it goes correctly from infinite (the markings are aligned) but at the other end it goes past 1m, is that normal?

I do need to find a way to clean the knurling bits of the camera, they are quite filthy

Re soft release button is just i like the aesthetic and is not a permanent mod, but i agree it is really smooth already.

I have finally some pictures from my first test roll, only 4 frames since I rolled only about 6 shots, and i sued a couples of them to test for any light leaks. Good news no leaks and no punctures.

The images are really crisp and well exposed (using a Hanimex Sekonic meter).


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/7102019_20191007_111205.jpg




http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/7102019_20191007_111258.jpg

All in all i think this is at the moment my favourite camera.

KR

Marco

Edited by - marcolin on Oct 07 2019 11:28:00 AM
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