Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Members | Search | FAQ
Username:
 Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 General Discussion
 Collectors and Users Open Forum
 Kiev 4 without logo on the clip		  New Topic
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Author  Topic Next Topic  
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Feb 25 2025 :  11:10:16 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello,

Lately, I fell across a 1968 Kiev 4 without logo on the clip, just the serial number, like on the 4a "no names".
Here is a photo of the seller:


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/2522025_6kfpthiy.png

The (rare) visible cameras of this type date of 1968. A commemoration of the strikes in january 1918 at Arsenal's? Sovietcams shows too a case with "50 years to Soviet Ukraine" engraved on its plaque. See here, please: https://www.sovietcams.com/cameras/detail/420vjwc7gr6cwye2e4ppf3pw51

What do you think?

Amitiés. Jacques.

Alexander K.
AlexanderK
Germany
599 Posts
Posted - Feb 27 2025 :  1:25:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Jacques,
I have also such Kiev-4 s/n 6817037. Regarding the case with "50 years..." I have a doubt, that it has something to do with this camera. I would expect some plate on the camera, such as "70 years..." on Kiev-19. It was absolutely common thing in the Soviet Union to put some soviet badges on the leather cases of different devices.
May be I am wrong, but I have never seen any other information except this case (it was rather long time on ebay).
If anyone has any it is very appriciated .

Regards, Alexander
Go to Top of Page

Juhani Halmeenmaki
cedricfan
Finland
1031 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Feb 27 2025 :  11:44:08 PM  Show Profile  Visit cedricfan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
"1968 the Soviet Union led Warsaw Pact troops in an invasion of Czechoslovakia to crack down on reformist trends in Prague. Although the Soviet Union's action successfully halted the pace of reform in Czechoslovakia, it had unintended consequences for the unity of the communist bloc"

Maybe a silent protest leaving "Made in USSR" away? Remember that they also did a version where Kiev was written in Ukranian, not Russian.

Best regards,
Juhani
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Feb 28 2025 :  03:39:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
In fact, I initially bought two of these Kiev 4 in reply to the thread "Kiev no name 1983". The "creation" of a no name 1968 would have been a joke, with the other one as a witness...

Probably no question to do so now. If these cameras are related in any way to the 1917-1921 Urainian-Soviet War, they will remain as they are, of course.

So, I have found three of these cameras without logo on the clip:
- a Kiev 4a # 6806307 (sold),
- two Kiev 4 # 6816322 and 6816711 (both mine). I will post photos when they are here.
Alexander, your # 6817037 has such a clip too?

Thanks to you and Juhani. We hope for other information and serial numbers!

Amitiés. Jacques.
Edited by - Jacques M. on Feb 28 2025 10:58:36 AM
Go to Top of Page

Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4265 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Feb 28 2025 :  09:56:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit Vlad's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hahahaha Juhani, you're reaching with that Czechoslovakian theory . Honestly it's probably something stupid - a logo press broke or that particular assembly line didn't have one available.

Cheers,
Vlad
Go to Top of Page

Juhani Halmeenmaki
cedricfan
Finland
1031 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Feb 28 2025 :  11:32:13 AM  Show Profile  Visit cedricfan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Actually I must ask my friends in Ukraine if 1968 was somehow special year!

Best regards,
Juhani
Go to Top of Page

Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4265 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Feb 28 2025 :  11:48:59 AM  Show Profile  Visit Vlad's Homepage  Reply with Quote
1968 was 50 year anniversary of short lived Ukranian People's Republic (UPR) (1918-1921)
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Feb 28 2025 :  3:38:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Vlad

1968 was 50 year anniversary of short lived Ukranian People's Republic (UPR) (1918-1921)


It's why there is a question about these clips.
Go to Top of Page

Alexander K.
AlexanderK
Germany
599 Posts
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  2:04:31 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Well, I have got today the second camera from 1968. It is Kiev-4a and also without any logo or "made in..." on the clip.
Here are my cameras:







Regards, Alexander
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  3:26:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

Very interesting. Thanks, Alexander.
I have not yet received my own ones.
So, we have now at least five 1968 Kievs without engraving on the clip (except the serial number).
Of course, it would be interesting to know if there are such other cameras. And I look for 1968 Kievs with "normal" clips: that can be useful too.

Amitiés. Jacques.
Go to Top of Page

Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4265 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  3:54:19 PM  Show Profile  Visit Vlad's Homepage  Reply with Quote
My suspicion is it's an export version. Often Сделано в СССР is eliminated, as it's not applicable in Cyrillic. And made Made in USSR stamp wasn't available at the time..
Go to Top of Page

Alexander K.
AlexanderK
Germany
599 Posts
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  4:04:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Vlad

My suspicion is it's an export version. Often Сделано в СССР is eliminated, as it's not applicable in Cyrillic. And made Made in USSR stamp wasn't available at the time..

I can agree with Vlad, but why only 1968? The last "no-name" export was made for USA in 1963/64. Export for Europe was hardly possible because of Contax copyrights.

Regards, Alexander
Go to Top of Page

Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4265 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  4:06:44 PM  Show Profile  Visit Vlad's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Maybe to East Germany or Soviet block were that copyright wasn't respected?
Go to Top of Page

Alexander K.
AlexanderK
Germany
599 Posts
Posted - Mar 04 2025 :  4:08:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jacques M.


... And I look for 1968 Kievs with "normal" clips: that can be useful too.

I have no Kiev Kameras from 1968 with "normal" clips, only these two. .

Regards, Alexander
Go to Top of Page

Juhani Halmeenmaki
cedricfan
Finland
1031 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 05 2025 :  11:40:08 AM  Show Profile  Visit cedricfan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Vlad

Maybe to East Germany or Soviet block were that copyright wasn't respected?

Finland was part of Europe and not Soviet block...

Best regards,
Juhani
Go to Top of Page

Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4265 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 05 2025 :  12:05:09 PM  Show Profile  Visit Vlad's Homepage  Reply with Quote
But no one knows how it got there, maybe from DDR:)
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Mar 06 2025 :  10:18:59 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

Perhaps we fetch too far...
The "40 years Ukraine" exists: it's the IIIa with an Ukrainian logo. It is confirmed by a very rare special box shown by Ulrich: https://ussrphoto.com/Wiki/default.asp?ContentID=560&ParentID=1&WikiCatID=20

So, why not a "special 50 years" ten years later?

Amitiés. Jacques.
Go to Top of Page

Juhani Halmeenmaki
cedricfan
Finland
1031 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 06 2025 :  11:51:03 AM  Show Profile  Visit cedricfan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Vlad

But no one knows how it got there, maybe from DDR:)


From DDR we got Praktica and AKA (toasters, hairdryers etc).

And I did find "proof": our "Kamera"-magazine used to publish a camera catalogue every year back then. And yes, it does list Kiev at least 1981! But poor success in sales, it cost about same as Zenit TTL. Importer is SU-owned "Koneisto" (means Machinery), which imported almost everything except cars from SU.


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/632025_IMG_20250306_174613.jpg

Also found UK-catalogue by Amateur Photographer from 1978 and even that had Kiev-RF's, importer TOE as expected

Best regards,
Juhani
Edited by - cedricfan on Mar 06 2025 11:53:09 AM
Go to Top of Page

Juhani Halmeenmaki
cedricfan
Finland
1031 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 06 2025 :  12:01:17 PM  Show Profile  Visit cedricfan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jacques M.


Perhaps we fetch too far...
The "40 years Ukraine" exists: it's the IIIa with an Ukrainian logo. It is confirmed by a very rare special box shown by Ulrich: https://ussrphoto.com/Wiki/default.asp?ContentID=560&ParentID=1&WikiCatID=20

So, why not a "special 50 years" ten years later?

Amitiés. Jacques.


A small clarification: KIEV is written in Ukranian in that special version, not in Russian. They are not same languages, although not far from each other. Look at two dots above the "i" instead of Russian "e". And a very annoying thing for SU-Russians to openly show nationality back then!
Mine has no box, only camera & lens.

Best regards,
Juhani
Go to Top of Page
Ulrich W.
uwittehh
Germany
859 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 06 2025 :  4:15:26 PM  Show Profile  Visit uwittehh's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I also found a 1968 Kiev 4 in my collection (or the remains of it ...), but it has a normal engraving in the accessory shoe.

Yes, the box for the KIIV III is really rare. 6 to 10 years ago a box went for about 300 euros on eBay. Last year, a KIIV III with box was auctioned off for 9000 euros. I asked the auction house because I have a KIIV III left, they replied that they would expect about 2000 for the camera, the box would be more valuable. I was quite surprised :-)

Remember: Increase my household contents insurance :-)

Ulrich

http://fotos.cconin.de
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Mar 06 2025 :  4:19:18 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

Thanks Juhani.
I know well that Kiev is written in Ukrainian on the 1958 version: I own two of them... On the 1968 one, there is no mention of Ukraine anywhere. Just the absence of "Сделано в СССР" on the clip. Is it enough to mean something?

As for the 1968 Kievs with a "normal" clip, I have found only two numbers: 6804708 and 6836078, both for Kiev 4. For the moment, these two ones "border" our small series.

Amitiés. Jacques.

Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Mar 08 2025 :  08:47:24 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:


Remember: Increase my household contents insurance :-)



Ha ha!
What is the s/n of your "normal" 1968 Kiev 4, Ulrich? It could be interesting to limit our special series.

Amitiés. Jacques.
Go to Top of Page
Ulrich W.
uwittehh
Germany
859 Posts
My Collection
Posted - Mar 10 2025 :  12:58:06 PM  Show Profile  Visit uwittehh's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Jacques,

the number of mine is 6801427.

Ulrich

http://fotos.cconin.de
Go to Top of Page
Jacques M.
France
2639 Posts
Posted - Mar 26 2025 :  11:07:16 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks, Ulrich.
The Kiev 4 s/n 6816332, without logo too, is here.


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/2632025_IMG_1871.JPG

I am going to put that in the wiki. Thanks for your remarks!

Amitiés. Jacques.
Edited by - Jacques M. on Mar 26 2025 11:11:37 AM
Go to Top of Page
   Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
USSRPhoto.com Forums © USSRPhoto.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000
Google