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Aidas Pikiotas
AidasCams
Lithuania
973 Posts
My Collection
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 Posted - Jul 08 2008 : 06:46:06 AM
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Thanks to Vlad, new very interesting book arrived to me from Russia! It seems to be the first ever issued book (1935) about particular camera FED. But the most interesting thing is information about two other Leica copies: VOOMP Pionier and FAG. Below you will find a scanned page. Could any of Russian speaking members translate this small text to other members of the group? I can say in brief, that authors are talking about new conceptional camera FAG ...
http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/fed-Leica_2.jpg
Best Regards,
Aidas
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4252 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 08 2008 : 10:45:03 AM
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Wow, an amazing wealth of information! Thanks for post this page Aidas! Let's outline the main points:
- In 1934 two parallel versions of Leica II were developed in USSR - FED at FED factory and Pioner at OGPU in Leningrad and given for production at Zavod Geodezia in Moscow.
- Up to spring 1935 FED quality was very inferior to Leica II until they had overhauled the production process, after that time the FEDs were not any worse than Leicas.
- Pioner was much more superior quality than 1934-Spring 1935 FED, but afterwards you cannot say that
- Only around 1000 Pioners were planned to be made and to be discontinued in 1936 in favor of camera codenamed "FAG" that was "radically" different from Leica design (how??). Camera was much more superior in design but that would depend of technical realization of it.
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4252 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 08 2008 : 10:46:26 AM
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| Why is VOOMP not mentioned????????? |
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Aidas Pikiotas
AidasCams
Lithuania
973 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 08 2008 : 11:45:56 AM
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Thanks Vlad!
According to the text you just kindly translated, we should call cameras, assembled in Zavod Geodezia as Pionier (Geodezia), not FAG as we do now. The name "FAG" was intended to be for the conceptionally new camera, much more advanced than regular Leica or FED or VOOMP Pionier ! 
Best Regards,
Aidas
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 08 2008 : 4:51:50 PM
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Hi all,
I believe tha FAG is the correct name. I know this because I owned a case for this camera and the letters "FAG" (in Cyrillic script) were impressed on the leather case, on the front, just as on a FED case. The case was slightly different from a FED case and was no doubt authentic. I no longer have this case as I gave it to a fellow collector and friend who has a FAG Geodezia camera. He agrees that the case is authentic.
This case was for a FAG Geodezia which is a very similar camera to the VOOMP Pioneer, not more advanced than FED, Leica, or Voomp-Pioneer, but almost identical to VOOMP-Pioneer, with the exception of the "diamond" shape of the front viewfinder window. It had a VOOMP lens and there are two versions of FAG ... please see Princelle, page 117.
I think "FAG" is an abbreviation for "Foto-Apparatus Geodesia". There is more information about the camera in Princelle and also an article from Sovetskoe Foto (1934 No.6) which I have put in the WIKI ... see below:
http://www.ussrphoto.com/Wiki/default.asp?WikiCatID=38&ParentID=4&ContentID=270&Item=Sovetskoe+Foto+1934+%2F+FAG+Geodeziya
Regards, Bill
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Aidas Pikiotas
AidasCams
Lithuania
973 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 03:55:19 AM
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Hi Bill,
Indeed, the problem is my bad english ... I didn't want to say, that camera we are calling FAG is not FAG at all. But initially FAG name was intended for another camera, according to the early source above. The project of "Pionier" was given for production at Zavod Geodezia. We can accept this information, while VOOMP Pionier and FAG are almost identical with only few minor changes as you have described recently.
But back to the mentioned source again, the project was given to Zavod Geodezia to continue the production of cameras, under initial name "Pionier"! Beside this, VOOMP have created a conceptionally new camera to be produced at Zavod Geodezia since 1936, under name "FAG" ...
My question is - where is prototypes, drawings and other technical documention of mentioned new camera? I understand, that project was failed unfortunately and Geodezia Pioniers have got the FAG name, but some archives of conceptional camera should survive until now ...
Best Regards,
Aidas |
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Bill Parkinson
nightphoto
USA
1027 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 10:13:58 AM
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Hi Aidas,
Oh, now I see what you mean. It may just be hypothetical talk about the new camera because of excitment about all the new production and design of the Soviet Leicas. So, maybe just some drawings and ideas, but no new camera since the book says it would depend on the "technical realization of it" ... sounds like no prototype yet.
Regards, Bill
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4252 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 10:54:44 AM
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Just an addendum, one other point I failed to notice and translate in this article (not relevant really to previous discussion, but important) is that Pioner-Geodezia would be an exact copy of FED except for the cassette (on which it says it will elaborate later in the book section not shown).
Vlad. |
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Aidas Pikiotas
AidasCams
Lithuania
973 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 11:19:15 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Vlad
Just an addendum, one other point I failed to notice and translate in this article (not relevant really to previous discussion, but important) is that Pioner-Geodezia would be an exact copy of FED except for the cassette (on which it says it will elaborate later in the book section not shown).
Vlad.
Thanks Vlad! Please find another page with cartridges for FED and Pionier ...
http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/fed-Leica_4.jpg
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Aidas Pikiotas
AidasCams
Lithuania
973 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 11:23:58 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by nightphoto
Hi Aidas,
Oh, now I see what you mean. It may just be hypothetical talk about the new camera because of excitment about all the new production and design of the Soviet Leicas. So, maybe just some drawings and ideas, but no new camera since the book says it would depend on the "technical realization of it" ... sounds like no prototype yet.
Regards, Bill
Hi Bill,
I would be very happy to see soviet camera totally different from regular Leica and much more advanced to be No.1 in the world ... |
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4252 Posts
My Collection
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Posted - Jul 09 2008 : 2:23:36 PM
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Thanks Aidas, I guess the only relevant information to our discussion here is that Pioner uses the 2nd cassette and FED uses the 4th cassette both on the left page. Advantage of FED cassette that is it only made of 2 major parts - spool and shell with cover, whereas the Pioner type has a spring, etc...
Vlad |
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Vladislav Kern
Vlad
USA
4252 Posts
My Collection
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FED-LEICA book
