Promiin

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Topic

Topic author: okynek

Posted on: 20080617202311

I think that this is early night vision devise what looks like a 8mm movie camera.
Probably it was designed for police and security personal.
It has 2 lenses. One for illuminations and second for sensor. It give razer satisfactorily green images.
I wonder if someone have more information on this "camera"?

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/DSCF6728.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/DSCF6727.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/DSCF6729.JPG

Replies

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20080618052956

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by okynek
 I think that this is early night vision device...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Nope. This is a pyrometer.

Reply author: okynek

Replied on: 20080618075144

Thank you Zoom! So this devise is for temperature measurement? It may explain the name - "Промiнь" - flame(?) But I still can not figured out how to use it? This instrument does not have any scale, only blurry green images in viewfinder. Any ideas?

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20080618083721

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by okynek
 So this devise is for temperature measurement? It may explain the name - "Ïðîìiíü" - flame(?)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
No. Ray, beam... (P.S. this is the Ukrainian language word)

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by okynek
 But I still can not figured out how to use it? This instrument does not have any scale, only blurry green images in viewfinder. Any ideas?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
It is so simple to find an information about this method: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrometer ;)

Reply author: okynek

Replied on: 20080619154056

Yes, I read this article, but it help me little to use the devise.
I wonder Zoom it you have Promiin and if you can direct me how to use it?

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20080620081634

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by okynek
 I wonder Zoom it you have Promiin and if you can direct me how to use it?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
No, I have not this device...
I think that for a referense you may use this link (in Russian):
http://promsouz.com/OAO_KPPZ_PIROMETR.html
(this is a modern variant of the same device)

Reply author: okynek

Replied on: 20080624201208

Thank you Zoom to direct me to this web side.
I'm extremely busy [:(] don't have much time to play more with this device.
If someone interesting on eBay one more camera like this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Russian-Night-Vision-monocular_W0QQitemZ320267057869QQihZ011QQcategoryZ83887QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting

Reply author: okynek

Replied on: 20100206123739

Today I can answer indefinitely that camera above is indeed night vision devise as it was suspected from the beginning. I found it cousin with paperwork and I finally find time to test both.
And Promin is probably not as old as I was thinking. It cousing PN-1 (pictures below) made by Isum Preborastoitelniy Zavod in 1993.
Because this forum is for Russian film cameras I posting this pictures just for the information because devises like this often advertised as unknown Russian movie cameras. And to be honest also because I'm happy to have it [:)] !

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/622010_DSCF0244.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/622010_DSCF0245.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/622010_DSCF0246.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/622010_DSCF0247.JPG

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/622010_DSCF0248.JPG

Reply author: fedka

Replied on: 20100209214228

The factory that made the night vision scope is also named after Dzerzhinsky... One would think that Dzerzhinsky was some kind of Soviet Barnack, not a GULAG founder.

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100210055038

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by okynek
 Today I can answer indefinitely that camera above is indeed night vision devise<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
PN-1, indeed, is the night vision device.
But "Promin" is the pyrometer, sorry.
See http://www.pribor-komplekt.ru/catalog_304.html

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100210055811

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by fedka
 One would think that Dzerzhinsky was some kind of Soviet Barnack, not a GULAG founder.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Sorry, but don't talk rot, if you don't know history. :((
Dzerzhinsky was died in 1926...

Reply author: nightphoto

Replied on: 20100210124109

Although a bit different from the subject of the night-vision and pyrometer devices, since there were factories and many other things named in honor of Dzerzhinsky in the Soviet Union, it is not hard to read about him and other aspects of Soviet and Czarist history. Here is one thing I read and below that there are two links to WIKI Encyclopedia entries for "Dzerzhinsky" and "Gulag". In my experience, history and personalities are never so simple, and popular views of both are usually not very objective.

"In the 19th century the Russian government deported around 1.2 million prisoners to Siberia. Most of the revolutionary leaders in Russia spent time in Siberia. This included Lenin , Leon Trotsky and Joseph Stalin.
After the Russian Revolution the labour camps in Siberia were closed down. These were later reopened by Joseph Stalin and opponents of his regime were sent to what became known as Glavnoye Upravleniye Lagere (Gulag)."
from http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/RUSgulags.htm

Links:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felix_Dzerzhinsky
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag

In the case of the FED factory, the fact that it was named after Dzerzhinsky does not have much to do with the beginning of the orphanage that eventually became a camera factory, and probably this is very true with most things that were named in his honor. Just as in most countries many institutions, public and private, are named after famous people, many who also have very complicated histories.

Regards, Bill

Reply author: fedka

Replied on: 20100210132311

I did not make a historical reference, it was a joke. But Dzerzhinsky was very popular for naming institutions, probably second to Lenin.

Revolutionaries who managed to die on their own, before Stalin's purges, were considered "good".

Reply author: nightphoto

Replied on: 20100210202112

I know you were joking Yuri, and I liked the joke too ... made me laugh! Sorry to be so serious. I think to get an institution named for you anywhere you don't have to be good ... just famous!

Regards, Bill

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100211071438

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 
from http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/RUSgulags.htm
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
You are seriously consider that this source is truthful? :(

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 In the case of the FED factory, the fact that it was named after Dzerzhinsky does not have much to do with the beginning...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
In 1927 A.S. Makarenko presented to GPU the project of the organisation of the Children's labour commune in Kharkov.
GPU -- is a organisation, well-known in the West as a "Stalin's secret police, predecessor of the KGB", which also was engaged to work with a homeless children and a minor criminals.
Ukrainian GPU board has made decision to name it in a honour of Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky, who has died one year ago. Necessary money (250000 rubles) have been released not only from a GPU funds, but most from a wages of GPU employees (best known in the West as a "bloody executioners"). In the end of 1927 year the Children's labour commune named after F.E. Dzerzhinsky has been opened.
Btw., the similar colonies have been confirmed still by emperor Alexander-II in 1866...

P.S. Also you may see this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juvenile_court to understanding a problem.

Reply author: nightphoto

Replied on: 20100211105443

Zoom,

Which part of the statement is not truthful (as to the source ... probably truthful sometimes and sometimes not ... like most sources ;-) :

"In the 19th century the Russian government deported around 1.2 million prisoners to Siberia. Most of the revolutionary leaders in Russia spent time in Siberia. This included Lenin , Leon Trotsky and Joseph Stalin.
After the Russian Revolution the labour camps in Siberia were closed down. These were later reopened by Joseph Stalin and opponents of his regime were sent to what became known as Glavnoye Upravleniye Lagere (Gulag)."
from http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/RUSgulags.htm

And as far as whether the FED Children's Labor Commune being named after Dzerzhinsky had much to do with the Commune itself, its proposed purpose, operation, and organization ... I would say probably no. It was not thought of by him, but by Makarenko and was just named in Dzerzhinsky's honor as he had recently died and was seen as an important hero. Yes, GPU was instrumental in the Communes founding, but not Dzerzhinsky. If he had been alive, no doubt he would have made decisions about the founding of it and then it may not have been named after him either.

Regards, Bill

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100211130654

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 
Which part of the statement is not truthful
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Whole.
Most terrible it when the truth is mixed with a lie.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 "In the 19th century the Russian government deported around 1.2 million prisoners to Siberia...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
On this place it is possible to stop.
From what source was such number? Well, let so.
But it for 100 years! So: 12000 to a year. 12000 criminals in a year it is a lot of? How many it was deported in Great Britain? Lets compare...
Second: an exiled person is not a prisoner.
Etc.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 It was not thought of by him, but by Makarenko and was just named in Dzerzhinsky's honor as he had recently died and was seen as an important hero.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Before this commune another has been organised (by Makarenko in 1921), named after M. Gorky, near Poltava.

Reply author: nightphoto

Replied on: 20100211175743

Well, I think you would have to be more specific about what the true facts are rather than just call the whole paragraph a lie.

For one thing, the definition of "deportation" means the expulsion of a person or group of people from a place or country. Not having to do with "exile" or necessarily "out of a country" ... it can also mean being moved to a different place.

Here is another statement I found :

"Siberia is virtually a synonym for a dire threat hung over the heads of dissenters. In 1914, about 9 million people lived in Siberia, of whom around 1 million were prisoners or deportees. Siberia came to house many of Russia's greatest novelists. Revolutionary opponents of the Czar were also likely to have suffered years of imprisonment in Siberia. Lenin, Stalin, and Trotsky all spent time in Siberian exile."

There are many references to the history of the Cazrs in the 19th and early 20th century regarding the amounts of criminals, political dissenters, and others who where imprisoned in Siberian prisons. In these references numbers vary but are mostly over 1 million. No one is saying 12,000 per year ... maybe some years more and some years less and probably it varied with the political climate and the particular Czar and administration in power. But it is quite clear that large numbers of prisoners being sent to Siberia was not a new thing invented by the Communists or implemented by Dzerzhinsky.

Regards, Bill

Reply author: fedka

Replied on: 20100211234944

I did not want to start this argument, sorry.

But Zoom, if you see an incorrect statement, please correct it to the best of your knowledge. That's what all these forums are about.

Bill finds information and shares it. It may or may not be correct, but we'll never know unless someone comes up with a better source.

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100212084931

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nightphoto
 But it is quite clear that large numbers of prisoners being sent to Siberia was not a new thing invented by the Communists or implemented by Dzerzhinsky.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Yes, but why you (or they) didn't compare this large numbers with a numbers of a deported in Great Britain to Australia (or in USA, or in France, etc.)? What country had more pursued people?
Therefore I see only a prejudiced opinion that in the "bloody" Russia all was bad, and on the contrary -- in the goody-goody West all was extremely well.
Sorry for offtopic...

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100212085640

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by fedka
 But Zoom, if you see an incorrect statement, please correct it to the best of your knowledge.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Dzerzhinsky was not the GULag founder.

Reply author: mermoz37

Replied on: 20100212090401

Hello, friends...
Think you seriously that it is the good place here, to discuss this kind of thing reserved for the historians and the statisticians?
I am afraid that it does not lead you to be any more as well gentlemen as it is fashionable.[;)]

your kindly friend,
Alain

Reply author: Zoom

Replied on: 20100212131134

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by mermoz37
 I am afraid that it does not lead you to be any more as well gentlemen as it is fashionable.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Dear Alain, I am not a gentleman... ;)

From Wikipedia ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentleman ):
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
"gentleman" signified a man with an income derived from property, a legacy or some other source, and was thus independently wealthy and did not need to work
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Reply author: nightphoto

Replied on: 20100212145844

Dear Zoom,

I think perhaps you are a gentleman of this modern day, although not in the original antiquated meaning of the word ;-)

From your own source:

"In modern speech, the term is usually democratized so as to include any man of good, courteous conduct, or even to all men (as in indications of gender-separated facilities, or as a sign of the speaker's own courtesy when addressing others)."

And now I am done on this subject as my friend and gentleman Alain objects!

Regards, Bill