New Boris Fakes?

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Originally posted by okynek

...The problem I see:
1. a lot of copies would exist, hundreds or thousands.
2. it does not explain all this aging marks, dirt, rust, scratches.
3. does not explain all this extra stuff on the bottom plate, or 36 frame counter.

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1. Not so many. 10--20 billets...
2. As I know, fake Zorkies-250 were made in 1990s...
Are you know a term: "to washing money"? A counterfeiters literally "wash" (without water, but with a pebble and pieces of wood etc.) a new spurious bank notes to making an "old view".
3. Yes, this is a question... Wherefore?..

And one important moment: a paper works (documentation, user manuals, packaging etc.)... Btw., oddly enough, it is more difficult and complex to falsify this things... Therefore we don't see a papers... ;)

quote:

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Originally posted by Vlad

I did not mean that Yolochka and Neper were produced by KGB, I just meant that if they wanted a reproduction camera they would've used those two as they probably have..

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Btw., the Soviet border guard (Pogranichnye voyska == frontier troops) was a KGB department... ;)

Here is one use of Yolka for KGB


(C) H. Keith Melton - Ultimate Spy

Zoom - I did not know that! Thanks for that bit of info, although I can't say I'm very surprised

So we should agreed at this point that we have NO any indication that this camera made by Soviet camera industry.
No any paperwork, no publications, no press realize,
no any witness, no users, no makers, no one basically can came forward to testify for this camera.
Then it could be made:
1. in 90-th "on Arbat" what means that it intentionally fake camera.
2. by some privet person in 50-60th for personal use.
3. by small legal shop to use with some special equipment.
4. outside the Russia to full collectors and strictly for profit.
Somewhere else ????

<quote> Btw., the Soviet border guard (Pogranichnye voyska == frontier troops) was a KGB department... ;)</guote>
Well Border Guards "Porranichniki" was part of the Ministry of Internal Ofears – "MVD";
same as VV "Vnutrennie Voiska" - internal guards or prison guards;
same as "Milisia" - police; same as KGB.
They are different branches of same Ministry of Internal Offears, they usually do not intersect in they work.
And GAI- government auto inspection or road polis belong to some other agency and it has nothing to do with Milisia.
While this info has nothing to do with cameras

quote:

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Originally posted by okynek

Well Border Guards "Porranichniki" was part of the Ministry of Internal Ofears – "MVD"...

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Sorry... Do not dispute against me... ;)

From 30.03.1918 -- in Narkomfin
In 1919 year -- in Narkomtorgprom
From 24.11.1920 -- "Osoby otdel VChK"
From 27.09.1922 -- in OGPU
From July 1934 -- in NKVD
From 1946 year -- in MGB
Only from 1953 to 1957 years -- in MVD!
Then up to 1991 year -- in KGB
From 1992 year -- in the Ministry of security
From 30.12.1993 -- a separate service (named as FPS from December 1994)
From 2003 year -- in FSB.

Hi Vlad and Everyone,

I would be careful to put too much faith into the "UltimateSpy" book of Melton as he has many mistakes. I doubt that this modification of Yolochka / Yelka was made by KGB, especially by the "Illegals Directorate" which I have not even heard of. Probably, like many of the things that are in the book, this camera was mis-represented to Melton. ... Not to say that there is not some very good information in the book as well.

The KGB was a huge organization, and although the Border Guards were part of KGB, when we are talking about the KGB-used cameras, we are probably talking mostly about things like F-21, Totchka, Zakhod, F-27, Zola, etc. made and used mostly by the Fifth Chief Directorate (Internal Security) and possibly the First Chief Directorate (Foreign Operations) which were likely to use concealed or hidden cameras for surveillance.

The Border Guards was a huge Directorate, but probably not engaged in covert surveillance. Probably, given the size of the entire KGB, almost all Soviet cameras were used by them to some extent, just as in the Military.

Here is a pretty good link that shows the different divisions of the KGB:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KGB#The_Directorates

Regards, Bill