Westlicht Auction / TSVVS (or VTS-VS)

To tell you the truth (and I looked at that picture before too a few times) I always thought it can also be a Leica because they have the chrome front plate around the lens mount too...

The photo of the officer with the camera shows the camera in its' case. I can't be sure if it is a Leica or TSVVS because the photo is unclear ... that's why I put ? in the caption.

http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/25112009_officertsvvs2web.jpg




http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/25112009_TSVVS3.jpg



Regards, Bill

But I don't think the chrome plate on the lens mount of any Leica goes straight down below the lens. Only on TSVVS, I think!

Regards, Bill

quote:

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Originally posted by nightphoto

...and the Colonel (who is a political officer) has a TSVVS camera

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Sorry, this is not a VTS-VS camera... This is FED* with the FED 2/50 mm collapsible lens, as I can see...

*) -- or Leica ;)

P.S. This is not a plate. This is the lens lever.
P.P.S. And you forgot to compare the years...

If it is a lens lever, then the case would have a cut-out so that the lever could move around the lens ... this case is cut close to the lens with no cut-out for the lever. Also, if this was a lever in a low position, then on a FED the upper left (as we look at it) of the area around the lens would look dark, not light like in the photo. and, the Sonnar lens on a TSVVS also has the collapsible look.

The closest Leica will be IIIf and it has a round slow speed dial, which the camera in this photo does not.

Regards, Bill

Zoom, what do you mean about "compare the years"?

Regards, Bill

quote:

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Originally posted by nightphoto

Zoom, what do you mean about "compare the years"?

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Sorry my English.
When this shot was done? Some days after 19 Febrary 1945.
Source: http://militera.lib.ru/h/kirichenko_pi/12.html *
When this camera was made? Four or five years later.

*) --

quote:

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Высоко были оценены заслуги многих частей и подразделений корпуса. По представлению командования Указом Президиума ВС СССР от 19 февраля 1945 года они были удостоены высоких правительственных наград.
...
10-й отдельный гвардейский минометный дивизион был награжден орденом Богдана Хмельницкого II степени.

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Zoom,

Oh ... now I see! Impossible to be a TSVVS! My lack of Russian language is, as always, a problem for me in this field of my interest. Thank you and I will change the caption on my web site.

Regards, Bill

Well, just to keep the conversation about TSVVS / VST-VS camera origin going a bit longer, here are some photos of numbers stamped on a German Contax and also my TSVVS. Please notice the similarity between the style of the numbers "6" and "3" .

It doesn't prove anything but is interesting when coupled with the idea that TSVVS has numbers stamped on the shutter cage and bottom plate and so does the Contax ... although that is not the case with the early Kievs made with German parts.

TSVVS



Contax


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/25112009_TSVVS21.jpg


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/25112009_fineitem_191.jpg



Regards, Bill

quote:

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Originally posted by nightphoto

If it is a lens lever, then the case would have a cut-out so that the lever could move around the lens ... this case is cut close to the lens with no cut-out for the lever. Also, if this was a lever in a low position, then on a FED the upper left (as we look at it) of the area around the lens would look dark, not light like in the photo. and, the Sonnar lens on a TSVVS also has the collapsible look.

The closest Leica will be IIIf and it has a round slow speed dial, which the camera in this photo does not.

Regards, Bill

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It does look like FED-S. The lens is most likely FED 50/2. Which still makes the Colonel an owner of a rare camera.

I am sure that the name of this camera should be VTSVS.
I wrote about it 9 years back, when showed a few cameras from my collection on the site of leica.boom.ru:

«TSVVS - one of the most enigmatic soviet cameras. I am not even sure that it is correctly named. There’s a plate with text: "To colonel Maksimov L.K. for a long and blameless service in parts of VTS S.A., from the VTS Chief on December 9th 1957"
This gives some basis to the unexpected assumption that it is necessary to read the name of the camera on the circle, as it was actually a normal practice in Russia, and it should sound - not VTSVS from Topographical Service of Air Force but VTSVS».
VTSVS=Voyenno-Topografitscheskaya Sluzhba Vooruzhennyh Sil (Militar Topographical Service of Defence Forces).

It took only 10 years till somebody heard about my opinion.

Hello Alexander,

Good to see you here! Thank you for your original idea about the name of the camera and it is correct, no doubt.

Do you know any other history about where the camera was made, such as the factory or location? Or, any other information that would be useful?

Regards, Bill

quote:

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Originally posted by Alexander Bronstein


It took only 10 years till somebody heard about my opinion.

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Exclude me from the list of "somebody"... ;)

I have edited the entry in the WIKI to reflect that the name of the camera is more likely "VTS-VS" rather than "TSVVS" as Alexander has noticed and written some time ago. However, I still left the name "TSVVS" in the title of the entry so that it could be found according to the previously thought name of the camera.

To my own thinking neither of these names are the actual name of the camera, but represent the military service that they were made under. Probably, like most military cameras, the name is letters and numbers only (like C-112 or AFA-47T, etc.).

Regards, Bill

HA! Hello Alexander and welcome to the site! Great to have here! I'm a big fan, love your site! .

Thank you for the clarifications for our English speaking members. I believe there is a consensus here at this point that this camera is to be "renamed" to VTS-VS (formerly known as TSVVS ) Thank you Bill for taking action! .

Again, Alexander welcome, I feel like one more apostle had joined the table . I am very excited to have you here and your expertise.

Best regards,
Vlad.

Originally this thread was about the VOOMP - Pioneer and the TSVVS that were up for auction at the Westlicht Camera Auction in Vienna.

Well, the VOOMP sold for 5,500.Euros ($8,169.00) + the buyers premium and the TSVVS sold for 950.Euros (1,411.00) + the buyers premium.

I think the buyers premium adds about another 18 - 20 percent onto the totals.

Regards, Bill

Ouch regarding VOOMP, but TSVVS sold for less than usual.... they go for about $2000 lately - no?

I've received an email this morning from Alexey Nikitin, a fellow collector in Russia. He had tried to enhanced Bill's photo of the disputed camera . Here it is:


http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent/10122009_fed-s.jpg

Thanks Vlad and Alexey! Did Alexey express an opinion on what camera this is that the the political officer has?

Regards, Bill

He thinks it's a FED-S