Kiev III/IV crossover model 1957

This i a very interesting Kiev 4 (?) camera wiki entry that warrants some discussion, first of all it has the "T"-shaped ridge on top of the light meter which is fairly atypical for the 1957 Kiev 4 and what happened to the flash sync contact? this is extremely weird. Denn I saw you post this, is there a photo of the bottom of the camera? does it have a leg like III or it's flat like IV?

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Originally posted by Vlad

Denn I saw you post this, is there a photo of the bottom of the camera? does it have a leg like III or it's flat like IV?

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http://www.ussrphoto.com/UserContent2/642024_1.JPG

Here it is. The camera was restored by me, as usual with such old copies long shutter speeds did not work or the braid breaks. It is my rule that everything that comes into my collection must work. I can say that inside it is a classic Kiev II/III of later releases, except for the exposure meter of course. It is known that the prototype Kiev 4 was introduced back in 1951. In almost 10 years of collecting and restoring film cameras, I have come across cases of these early Kiev IVs. Some of them had synchro contact. There is an opinion that in the beginning of production the cases from II/III models were used. It is not known what this is related to. Perhaps they did not have time to establish production of new cases, or their quantity was insufficient. I think we will never know.

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Originally posted by Denn_kirov
It is known that the prototype Kiev 4 was introduced back in 1951.

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Thanks, that info seems to come from DVDTechnik as it can also be found on sovietcams.com. Could you say more about the (internal) differernces? Lightmeter and feet are obvious.

sovietcams.com also lists a Kiev 4a "type1" from 1956 with a food from a II/III and a Kiev 4a style rewind knob. I'm a bit sceptical as this could also be a later modification as the rewind knobs of the Kiev 4a and II are easyly interchangeable.

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Originally posted by treehorn

[quote]Originally posted by Denn_kirov
It is known that the prototype Kiev 4 was introduced back in 1951.

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I did not see any differences from the later Kiev II/III with this specimen. The same shutter, with the same shutter speeds. Same mechanics. I must say that the shutter on Kiev devices are mechanically interchangeable. Not so long ago I had a Kiev V, which had to have the shutter from the III. The shutter cocking and rewind knobs are theoretically interchangeable too. The seats are identical.
The only difference is the exposure meter. The exposure meter is a classic Kiev IV with a simplified scale.
And lastly, some information for reflection. A long time ago, about 7...8 years ago, an elderly man asked me to restore the camera's operation. It was a Kiev IV 1952 !!! with a 1954 Jupiter 8 lens. Unfortunately I don't remember now, what kind of exposure meter frame he had (smooth or with ribs). The man claimed that the device was purchased in Ukraine in the company store of the Arsenal factory and had never been repaired. The case was a classic Kiev III.
The period of work of the Arsenal factory from 1951 to 1957 is the most rich in various mysteries. It is very bad that there are no archives of the factory in free access and the information has to be collected literally by bits and pieces.
I trust elderly people who bring their old machines for maintenance more than re-buyers. Such people can tell the whole story of how they came into possession of the camera, sometimes with documentary evidence.
Best regards.

The thing is that so many components are interchangable. You can effectively make any combination of meter, shutter speed dials etc. Also accessory shoes with the serial number can be easily swapped. The tripod bush was redesigned and did move slightly sideways when the Kiev 4 came out but shutter crates, top covers, front covers etc., can all be interchanged. Thats not to say there may be some genuine unusual cameras out there..
Cheers,
Steve

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Originally posted by SteveA

The thing is that so many components are interchangable. You can effectively make any combination of meter, shutter speed dials etc. Also accessory shoes with the serial number can be easily swapped. The tripod bush was redesigned and did move slightly sideways when the Kiev 4 came out but shutter crates, top covers, front covers etc., can all be interchanged. Thats not to say there may be some genuine unusual cameras out there..
Cheers,
Steve

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Exactly. For this reason I take cameras with a history of ownership and if possible with documents from the owners, not from resellers.
Best regards.

It seems for me to be repaired. May be the lightmeter was changed, but the owner wanted to have original s/n as in the camera att.

Regards, Alexander