Albar 15

We are still waiting great collectors Alain Berry and dr.Milos Mladek here in the forum ... I'd like to ask Yuriy Davidenko (Ukraine) and Viktor Suglob (Belarus), but their problem is english as I know. And many many others ... Thar would be great indeed!

Next time we're have an interesting thread I'll send it to Alain for his opinion :) Just like I tricked Juhani ;) (Sorry man! :) )

Vlad.

No tricks, I just couldn't resist
Just like a rare camera in ebay
And honestly, I didn't know about this forum until your email!

http://www.cedricfan.sivut.ws/Juhani's%20website%20ORIGINAALIT/

Well, great to have you here Juhani! :)

Vlad

So I'm looking at Albar-15 and comparing it to Zenit 12XS and Zenit 21XS... My Albar-15 version is exactly the same in everything as the Zenit 21XS camera, and I would think that the Albar-15 version with 1/1000 is the same as Zenit 12XS, basically it's just a different name tag right?

quote:

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Originally posted by Vlad

So I'm looking at Albar-15 and comparing it to Zenit 12XS and Zenit 21XS... My Albar-15 version is exactly the same in everything as the Zenit 21XS camera, and I would think that the Albar-15 version with 1/1000 is the same as Zenit 12XS, basically it's just a different name tag right?

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Vlad,
does your Zenit-12xs has 1/1000s? My both Zenit-12xs and -21xs have usual 1/500s indeed ...


Regards,
Aidas

I don't have a 12XS, only 21XS, but Wiki Entry for 12XS says they come with 1/1000

Vlad.

12xs from 1993 and with 1/1000 sec



Albar from 1993 with 1/1000



Another one with 1/500 (unknown year, not mine)



21xs from 1994 with 1/500 but otherwise very close to Albar & 12xs



15M from 1994 looks same as the others, so my main question is why BeLOMO played with the model names and shutter speed? I can understand using Albar as it has a link to Belarus (white), and I could understand adding 1/1000 to one top model...

In my opinion only real updated one worth a new name (except Albar with 1/1000) is the 130:

Juhani,

your information about Zenit-12xs with 1/1000s added is very new for me, many thanks! While all these Zenit versions are exact copies of each other, it's quite easy to replace the top plate of particular camera, so ........... Zenit-12xs, -21xs, etc. can be found with 1/1000s speed added. I suppose all these replacements were executed inside BeLomo plant to sell the stolen (or given as a salary ) cameras at better prices ...


Best Regards,
Aidas

Started the serial number collecting in Wiki for Albar-15 as my third one arrived today.
Many thanks to Liettua!

Smena rules

I don't recall if this was addressed in this forum or not, but I own a 21XS which has a green Zenit engraving instead of a white engraving. I've seen others with the green engraving as well. Was there some difference between the two or just a decorative decision ?

Steve

Steve,

I don't think these two "colour" variations are somehow otherwise different indeed.

Best Regards,
Aidas

Interesting, so far all three serials are 931xxxx

PS My archives say that my previous one was also 93 but I haven't recorded the actual number

Okay, so I did do some summarizing of what BeLOMO made to find the reasons & answers.

ET with metal top & bronze plastic top up to 1993 and black plastic top was propably a later version

Albar tends to be 1993 (four out of four so far)

21XS, 12XS and 15M seem to be usually 1993/94

So my theory is. In 1993 young Belarussia got into problems using the name Zenit, and invented the Albar-name, which is also something a newly reborn country would easily do as the national spirit is high. Maybe even the parts to make old ET ran out and KMZ didn't want the production to continue?
BeLOMO changed slichtly the top design, easy to see from the battery compartment, and some other things, but not much.
Later in 1993 they did however change the name back to Zenit, sa there is Belarus-time-BeLOMO-Zenits made in 1993. Unfortunately I haven't recorded the serials, only years. Why and when is unclear, maybe Zoom would know? As I can't read Russia I can't find the answers in KMZ-website...

Now the questions are:

-What serials starting with 93 are known from 12XS/21XS/15M? My guess is 932xxxx and not smaller

-Does anyone own or seen other Belarus-time Zenits from 1992 but ET? My guess is Albar was the first non-KMZ-derived-model

-Do the 90ies BeLOMO serials aways start with another number than zero? And I mean the serial itself, after the first two digits for the year. Even the Elikon-numberless and Elikon-2 serial numbers in Wiki don't start with zero, not one. The both known Elikon-2 serials are 918xxxx and I do doubt that over 80.000 were made!

Smena rules

Juhani,

My Zenit-12xs has #9301792, so its's smaller than #932xxxx;
I do possess Zenit-ET #9247425 with black plastic top plate;
Viktor have told me once, that appr. 200 units of Elikon-2 camera were made totally ...

Best Regards,
Aidas

So there goes down the toilet the theory that Zenit-name was banned and Albar used instead.
And that BeLOMO-serials would start with other than zero.
I guess this won't be solved by us.

I dug out my Zenit 21XS and am enclosing the serial numbers.

Body #9472219
Lens #9644782

The lens is a Helios 44M-7

Steve

Well Steve, if your serial # blew Juhani's theory out of the water - check this out: my 21XS is 96195379

quote:

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Originally posted by Vlad my 21XS is 96195379

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One thing is now for sure, the serials have nothing to do with real quantities, as 195379 cameras in 1996 is simply impossible.

And today I recieved my latest 12XS which is precisely same as my 15M except for serial number and model. Made in 1993 and 93-12845 so again smaller than the Albar-serials. One more proof that IF there was an argue about the name Zenit then it wasn't for a long time, and propably only in the end of 1993. Albar 93-15113 and Zenits 93-12845 & 93-01792 & 94-16211 don't leave a lot of room in between! Neither was there a series of serials for Albar, as 93-1xxxx cn be found on both brands.

Smena rules