Forerunners of Kiev 1947

Hello,

When I began collecting these cameras, I was much surprised by their general condition: many of them seem almost new. Visibly, not or only few used: gifts, as it is often said?
The paint of the ivory ones is of course more fragile than the chrome of the regular ones. And this 27972 seems to have all the external details of the Jena Contaxes. So, original, repaint, or even fake?

That said, you know these cameras much better than me, Stefan!

Amitiйs. Jacques.

Dear Jacques,

make some quick tests:

1) remove the back: does it feel heavy (a) or light (b)?
2) look through the finder: is the distance meter silver (a) or golden (b) ?
3) remove one of the 4 screws that fix the film plate (preferably one at the bottom: is the head of the screw cylindric (i.e. massive) (a) or more filigree (b) ?

if all 3 answers are (a), then it is likely a true ivory Contax.....

Good luck and report back, thanks!

best
Stefan

Hi Stefan,

I don't own any ivory: it's out of my possibilities!
But I know these tests. My "regular" Jena Contaxes are OK, except for the first ones concerning the weight of the back. Of course...

Amitiйs.

Hi Stefan,

I think you are right. According to the data I have the Ivory 27972 is a fake camera.

Ulrich

http://fotos.cconin.de

Hem...
I have just verified my own listing and there is no doubt. The 27972 is a fake. I should have checked earlier.
Thanks, Stefan and Ulrich!

Amitiйs.

Another regular Jena Contax here (s/n 27996), that time with a Topogon 25mm and its correct universal finder (both added after).



The Topogon is said to have inspired the Orion 15.

Jacques.

regarding the ivory 27972 Contax in the thread above: the leather case is most likely a true one..........

... and the similarities between the leather case and the leatherette are astonishing.

Well I am just back from Ukraine last month and I took a complete Kiev-4AM set with a beam splitter, 50mm J-8M, a 35mm J-12 and a 85mm J-9. Do not ask me what I was doing there, it had something to do with a Leopard (1) tank training.

It is a great camera set and I am very happy with it. For the rest I have seen a lot of misery and too many funerals.

I also took my Leica M7 set with me (and back). So I made some photos on Kodak 5222 XX film and on the way back to the Netherlands I have visited a former Ukrainian photo model living in Dьsseldorf (Germany) now. It was an emotional visit because just before the war she had a cancer diagnose, whomp removed and bleeding on the way to Germany. Fortunately a little bit recovered but we talked a lot and I made a photo shoot with her. I am sure she could use the extra money for it.

Robert
"De enige beperking in je fotografie ben je zelf"
http://gallery.fotohuisrovo.nl/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fotohuisrovo/

Robert
"De enige beperking in je fotografie ben je zelf"
http://gallery.fotohuisrovo.nl/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fotohuisrovo/

Hello,

Another Jena Contax arrived here yesterday.

But it is not numbered:

Absolutely nothing on (and inside) the body. Just what could be a serial number on the back, half hidden by the film roller: perhaps 11875, at first sight...



This camera has all the visible features of the Jena Contax, except the finder which shows the remarkable X when you look through the large window: a Dresden Contax feature (impossible to show).

I wonder where and by whom it was made: perhaps mounted for black market... Impossible to trace when there is no number...

Amitiйs. Jacques.
PS: I bought it without lens. The western Sonnar was added for the photo.

Of course, this camera has nothing in common with that one:

http://ussrphoto.com/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2827

I have opened it to know more. But it is "only" an ordinary Jena Contax.
Here is a photo of the prism. With the X, no doubt it is a Dresden part. A good number of early Kievs have this same prism which comes from the "transportation" from Dresden to Kiev.



Usually, the Jena Contaxes have a prism with only one inside visible line, from the front left to the back right. The later Kievs too, but every FSU collector knows that

Comments are welcome!
Amitiйs. Jacques.

Hello,

just to add some further data, before finding the time to take proper pictures of the piece, I can say that my "Jena" Contax is body nr. 27893 (same number, engraved to the inside of the back, "heavy" sheet-brass type); the lens mounted on it, is a Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 50/2 "red T", nr. 3051152, from a batch of 1500 pieces, whose production was set in the summer of 1947.

All the best,

Enzo

Hello,

we had a lot about the Jena Contax, including the "ivory" version. There is also a black face version. Some cameras were sold recently at Leitz Photographica Auctions:

28039 + Sonnar 2/5cm T (3059673): Leitz Photographica Auction #41 (November 2022); hammer price 3120 Euro
https://www.leitz-auction.com/en/Carl-Zeiss-Jena-Contax-II-Black-Face/AI-41-41100
28068: Leitz Photographica Auction #37 (November 2020); hammer price ca. 4000 Euro
28079: Leitz Photographica Auction #36 (June 2020); hammer price ca. 5000 Euro

I was very lucky to find another one of them with the serial number 28073. Als serial numbers are very close and all cameras show the same characteristics of the Jena Contax.

And there was a very interesting Jena-Kiev (or Kiev-Jena) at Wetzlar Camera Auction #5 in October 2023, Lot 228: http://s759420438.online.de/A5/mobile/index.html
You can find it at liveauctioneers (login required): https://www.liveauctioneers.com/price-result/arsenal-kiev-ii-carl-zeiss-jena-contax-ii/

It was sold for about 14.000 Euro. From the auction text:
"Probably the rarest version of the Kiev II, still produced by Carl Zeiss Jena. Two serial numbers, 5913 and 470038, as well as the "Carl Zeiss Jena"-logo engraved on the accessory shoe. The number 16 stamped inside twice. The back door without engraving of a serial number. The name ring of the later, so-called "no name" lens, without any engraving of a model or manufacturer designation, just engraved with "Jena 1:2 f=50 mm Nr. 3501248". Very few of these cameras are known and have not been shown in any specialist literature to date. The total production is unlikely to have exceeded 50 pieces."

Congratulations for your Jena Contax "black face". Rare cameras! Probably around fifty in the 28xxx range, and perhaps some others on the 305xx range, by my data...
Thanks for the photos of your #28073. The 2/50mm Sonnar (not the usual 5cm) is interesting too. Your "black face" is not the only late Jena Contax to have received such a Sonnar in millimeters (still by my data).

Amitiйs. Jacques.

Treehorn,

congratulations! What a great find! I have 2 Jena Contax (in chrome) with serial numer 278xx, so close to yours. Are you able to disassemlbe them? It would be very interesting if there are markings from the craftsman that has assembled them.
Mine are both marked with a CA or AC, which could be the initials of August Coutandin, a guy who worked at Zeiss Jena in those years.

See the picture for the marking:



Ulrich



http://fotos.cconin.de