Bought another B prefix s/n Kiev 3

Hi cerdicfan,
Has the aperture knob the letter "F" before 22,16… ?

Yes, "F: 22 16 " and so on
Does this mean something?

http://www.cedricfan.sivut.ws/Juhani's%20website%20ORIGINAALIT/

Hello,

This means your kiev 3 meter is still a mystery

Here's what we see on an early kiev 3 instruction manual :



Does anybody own another manual with instructions for DIN meters ?

Best,
Jed

To Sovietcam,

About "Volga" camera, Peter Hennig says :" …Zeiss were informed that the Russians intended to set up a production of 5.000 Contax cameras a month… The working name of this camera project was ordered to be VOLGA.

…In 1947 approximately 2.000 Contax were officially built in this project at the Zeiss factory in Jena. The majority of these were the Contax II model, along with a few Contax III and some others wearing the new name KIEV in Cyrillic block letters. …"
So, I think no Volga model was produced.

To Kievuser,

Princelle reads : "Officially produced from 1952, some Kiev III have been seen with s/n 49 and 51."
(Wich confirms your message dated 12/26/2007)
Nevertheless I'm not sure one can say "mass production" (?)

Best regards,
Michel.

To Cedricfan,

I don't know…
But the cell is probably from Zeiss.(DIN)
And we can guess that the Knob is too.
Maybe the engraving was then of best quality ? I mean more carefully realized.


But I don't really know.

In my opinion, all these "mysteries" make Kiev collecting quite exciting

Regards,
Michel.

I don't know how much of it is true, but for many years ago I did read a very convincing story about how Contax became Kiev. So the following is no fact but based on my memory from what I read, and if someone knows the website where the complete story is please link.

The Contax factory was to be moved completely to Ukraina after WW2. As everyone knows both Germany and USSR were seriously damaged, and nothing worked well. Plus there was many priority things to do, like getting food. The factory was put into pieces and loaded on to train. But Germany has different rails than Ukraina, so on the border all boxes had to be loaded to a different train, which caused a lot of boxes to get ruined and lost. So when everything was finally gotten unloaded at the final destination it was clear that the parts could never make a factory.
The solution was to bring German engineers to build up the damaged & missing factory pieces. So finally after some years real production finally got started, but slowly. Some parts were old Contax stocks, some made by Contax tools & machines and some with the newly manufactured tools & machines. Which were mostly done in Ukraina by German Contax-personnel. First cameras were surely assembled from old spare parts fully manually and by no means as factory prodution line.
Naturally the old parts did run out in some years, but not all at the same time. And some parts were exactly same as the old ones as they were done with same tools. But some were new, made in Ukraina by Contax-personnel, some also already modified to make Kiev. Naturally first goal was to get production running and to make working cameras, so hiding the German origins was not a priority. But as years passed and new tools & machines was required they were modified to Kiev. Like film speed dial from DIN to GOST.

Based on all what I have later read this story sounds very convincing, so my opinion is that it is a good explanation why the early Kievs slowly shift from Contax to Kiev, and finding two exactly alike cameras can be difficult.
Also it is good to remember that the metered camera was not taken into production as early as the meterless. So they propably still had "new old stock" of Contax parts/tools/machines for the meter part when the camera parts were already used in making "Kiev-II"?

http://www.cedricfan.sivut.ws/Juhani's%20website%20ORIGINAALIT/

Hi, Michel,

I assumed mass production according to the s/n of your camera, well passed 1,000 cameras. Maybe we should call it regular production as opposed to only a few prototypes? I am also not sure if Kiev II, III shared the same group s/n, then we don't know exactly how many Kiev IIIs were made in 1951.

Cheers,

Zhang

michel

i think also, that no volga cameras was produced. i think, it give only drawings 11.1.1946 - 26.11.1946. at this date, all drawings became the name kiev.
no 1000 cameras were built in 1947. approximately 235 cameras - 2. and 3. preserie ( contax II ), 1. preserie ( contax III ) and cvj kiev prototype.
and 450 cameras from the 1. production ( kiev ). this cameras had inside a contax-engraving ( n°47051-47500 ).

To Cedricfan,

I think the articles you read some time ago could be from ZeissHistorica?

Regards,
Michel.

Here are some 'B' numbers I have collected FYI.
B 541139,B543224,B542683,B544194,B544466,B545494.

Please add to this list if you have more.

Cheers,

Kievuser

quote:

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Originally posted by jed

Hello,

We may need a 'database' where everyone can quote camera s/n, s/n prefix, front plate and so on !

Best,
jed

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Hello Zhang,

Believe it or not, I just bought a 1954 B prefix Kiev 3

Mine is B 542140

No DIN meter.

I'll post pictures when I'll receive it.

All the best,
Jed

Hello jed,

Congratualtions! These 'b' Kiev 3 are quite rare.

I noticed that all the scale marks on Kiev 3 meters are not exactly the same.It seems that each meter is individully calibrated, and marked.

Best regards,

Zhang

quote:

---

Originally posted by jed

Hello Zhang,

Believe it or not, I just bought a 1954 B prefix Kiev 3

Mine is B 542140

No DIN meter.

I'll post pictures when I'll receive it.

All the best,
Jed

---

Here's an entry in the Wiki :

http://www.ussrphoto.com/wiki/default.asp?ContentID=712&ParentID=4&WikiCatID=66

BTW : please add a close up picture if you have one

Yes, the picture would be greatly appreciated for that Wiki entry.

Thanks!
Vlad.

Hello Zhang,

Very interesting. Can you elaborate or post close up pictures ?

Best,
Jed

quote:

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Originally posted by Kievuser

Hello jed,

I noticed that all the scale marks on Kiev 3 meters are not exactly the same.It seems that each meter is individully calibrated, and marked.

Best regards,

Zhang

---

Here's what we can see on a - gorgeous - 1956 Kiev 3A :

Hello Jed,

I will take some pictures. I have 7 Kiev 3,3As with 4 versions of marks. The line for 2 is not the same, some is straight, and some are bent to either way. The space between it the the diamond mark for '0'is not the same in width.

Cheers,

Zhang

quote:

---

Originally posted by jed

Hello Zhang,

Very interesting. Can you elaborate or post close up pictures ?

Best,
Jed

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kievuser

Hello jed,

I noticed that all the scale marks on Kiev 3 meters are not exactly the same.It seems that each meter is individully calibrated, and marked.

Best regards,

Zhang

---

Here's what we can see on a - gorgeous - 1956 Kiev 3A :

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Hello Zhang,

Great !

Thanks for sharing.

Here's a close up picture of the top plate - same camera, Kiev 3A s/n 5616299



Best,
Jed

Hello All,

I've just got mine today Well worth the wait, the camera is nice and 100% functional - even the lightmeter is ok !

See :




To illustrate what Zhang said about the Kiev meter, here's a comparison with an original Contax III camera :

Near mintish Kiev-III serial A 535648 with a plastic exp guide in ERC-pocket.

Film speed "10° DIN" scale

Hello Juhani,

interesting camera. My newest Kiev III (with "B" before serial) has the number 540221, so it's close to yours, but it has no Contax parts anymore. And the best, it looks and works like new :-)

Ulrich

http://fotos.cconin.de